Running Dialogue

I love listening to podcasts as I do yard work. So last weekend, I enjoyed the October 1 edition of Running Dialogue, Creative Loafing’s Podcast About Movies, as I mowed the lawn. The podcast is hosted by longtime friend (and Creative Loafing pop culture critic [not his official title, just my label]) Curt Holman along with Collider‘s Matt Goldberg and /Film‘s Russ Fischer.

Last week’s episode partially focused its attention on the Aaron Sorkin/David Fincher film, The Social Network. Holman, Goldberg and Fischer did more than review the film, though, as they actually provided some great perspective on Facebook trends in general. Over the years, Holman’s periodic presence on local AM/arts radio has allowed his vocal chops to mature immensely. As my friend, I’ll admit my bias, but he is my favorite of the three hosts.

At present they’ve recorded 17 episodes and I heartily recommend you give the show a listen.

As of late, one of the show’s new features is Who Did It Better?, a comparison/poll of who does the better cover version of a certain song. This week’s entry is The Beatles’ Across the Universe–reinterpreted by Fiona Apple and Jim Sturgess. Go here to listen and/or weigh in with your opinion.

In addition to mentioning the podcast, I want to heartily recommend that once the Oscar ceremony starts you should head over to Screen Grab, Creative Loafing’s Movie and TV blog where Holman and others will be liveblogging the event. I’ll likely be lurking in the comment sections, making snide asides as the show or the blog inspires me.

Sound Opinions

Normally my favorite part of American Public Radio’s Sound Opinions is toward the end, when the show’s listeners call in with their supporting or counter points to the opinions of Chicago-based music critics, Jim DeRogatis and Greg Kot. But this week, the show (which describes itself as “the world’s only rock and roll talk show”) introduced me to the French band Phoenix, through an interview and in-studio performance.

The set that Phoenix played on this episode included:

• Lisztomania
• Playground Love
• 1901

I often appreciate how the show will mix snippets of the studio version into the show as a juxtaposition for the live versions that listeners get to hear.

If you’ve never heard of the show, do yourself a favor and give it a listen on your MP3 player (or at the show’s site on your computer). If this episode does not interest you, check out some of the archive (they wisely provide links to a variety of musical artists) as DeRogatis and Kot cover a variety of musical genres each and every week.

Tim O’Shea: In the About section of the blog, you note the show “is an experiment which will change and grow as needed.” How has the show changed and grown since it first launched?

Shelby Miller: The Shifted Sound podcast began as a way to share new music with people who might not hear it otherwise. Before I started the show, as I searched the internet for more music to listen to personally, I discovered more and more independent bands who were producing great songs and I was constantly telling my friends and coworkers about them. I eventually decided to try it on a broader scope with a podcast. So, in that respect, Shifted Sound has remained the same. I still feel like I’m sharing some great music with friends. What has evolved a bit is how I approach the show. When I began, I always plays two songs each from five different bands. And, of course, they were probably bands I hadn’t played before. Now I’m a bit more lenient with myself as far as how many bands I play, and I’ve started playing a couple of songs per show that I have played before as a bit of a reminder for listeners. One of the issues I’ve had over the more than two years of producing Shifted Sound is that I am often moving on too quickly. I have to spend so much time looking for new music that I can’t really get to know too many bands, which I regret. Playing some of their music repeatedly on the show allows me to go back and rediscover and enjoy music that might have slipped off my radar a bit too quickly. I also ran into a period last year where I was a bit burned out on it all and decided to go down to a show every two weeks. That didn’t last too long, though, because I had too much music I wanted to share. So now I record two shows on one night, but still post one per week. That way I get every other week off from having to organize and complete a show.

O’Shea: For folks that want to listen to the show directly from your website (versus downloading the podcasts) I find the interface you use to be almost seamless. Was this the first application you tried or did you start using that platform after trying others?

Miller: I’ve been very happy with WordPress as the basis for the Shifted Sound website. It’s very easy to work with and pretty versatile as far as plug-ins and themes go. The player I’m using now is a plug-in by Martin Laine called simply “Audio Player.” Before that, I didn’t actually have an embedded player in the site. I figured listeners would just click on the mp3 link and listen. Once I started looking at embedded players, though, I knew I had to add one to the website. I think podcasts are still evolving and it’s unclear how many people subscribe to the show, how many download through the website but listen in some other way, and how many simply use the player. So, for those who just want to listen through their browser with the show notes right in front of them, I think the player I have installed works beautifully.

O’Shea: How long does it take to put together an average show (with Myspace and ITune links included)?

Miller: That’s actually a very tough question to answer. The show itself probably takes about two to three hours to record, complete the links within the show as well as the show notes. I do a bit of research for every show and make sure I have notes on every band. I also add album art and links to the AAC version of the show. And I make an mp3 version for the listeners who prefer that format. All those things take time. What takes more time is simply looking for music. Luckily, I’ve developed enough relationships with independent artists, labels and promoters that it’s gotten easier to find new music. Quite a bit comes to my in box every week. However, a lot of that doesn’t really fit with Shifted Sound, so I have to listen to it all to pick the music I want to play. I also visit about twenty-five music blogs a couple times a week to see what they have posted. It’s one of those things that I do at work as I’m waiting to hear back from a client, or rendering some graphics I’m working on, so it happens in fits and spurts.

O’Shea: How hard was it to gain the cooperation/support of local record stores, given that you also try to support iTunes and other Internet musical/social network ventures equally? Over time have you found that certain indie record labels have cooperated with you more?

Miller: I haven’t really affiliated with any indie records stores. Other than CD Baby, there is no one record store, either internet or real world, that I consistently send listeners to. I am a big fan of the artists and labels who let me play their music. So, when I provide links to buy an album from an artist I’ve played, more often than not, it’ll be to the band’s website or the label’s website. That way, listeners can buy some music while giving the largest share of the profits possible directly to the people responsible for the music. Other than that, I really make no attempt to support any particular internet stores or social sites. I’ll send listeners to iTunes if that’s the only way to get an artist’s music. I recently started putting eMusic links in the show notes because I restarted my subscription and thought those links might be helpful to listeners. And I added a Last.fm player to the website so listeners could stop by and see what I was listening to. I do all those things for the listeners, not out of a desire to support the services. As far as labels go, yes, there have definitely been some labels who not only allow me to play the band I’m asking about right then, but also keep me in the loop when it comes to their new releases, often going as far as mailing me preview discs. And, of course, I really appreciate that because, again, it makes finding new music easier. And I’ve discovered that I often end up following labels and looking forward to certain releases simply because I know the kind of music that label releases. That’s definitely something I never did just a few years back.

O’Shea: You’ve followed music for many years–given your wealth of knowledge have there been musicians that you enjoyed years ago who had dropped off the entertainment radar in more recent years, only to resurface, much to your delight?

Miller: You know, I’m much, much more into newer artists these days. However, I’m a child of the eighties, so it’s fun when Brian will play something on the Coverville podcast from on of my favorite eighties bands that I didn’t know was still recording. He’s recently had stuff from Naked Eyes, Tears for Fears and Men at Work’s Colin Hay, who also had a tune on the Garden State soundtrack. But, I can’t say I’ve been a huge fan of any group I listened to who I feel has had a noteworthy rebirth.

O’Shea: You’re based out of Texas, which is known for its musical diverse history, thanks to cities like Austin and musicians like Townes Van Zandt, Lyle Lovett among others. What musicians or genres define Texas for you?

Miller: I’ve said on Shifted Sound before that I don’t play enough music from my own back yard. It’s true. I think that’s because I find most of the music I play on the internet, so geography is not a boundary. Since I have three kids and am generally a grumpy old fart when it comes to socializing, I don’t go to many shows. I have to be really picky if I’m spending a night out. So, I don’t know as many of the bands who are playing within a few miles. Since I grew up here, though, I have a definite sense of what Texas music means to me, and it’s a pretty varied representation. Of course, the epicenter of Texas music for me is Willie Nelson. I heard a lot of country music growing up and Willie was the one I heard most often although I got plenty of George Jones and Waylon Jennings as well. In the eighties, ZZ Top was a big Texas icon for me as were the Fabulous Thunderbirds. As I grew up and expanded my musical tastes a bit I discovered Lyle Lovett and Stevie Ray Vaughn. I think they are both quintessential Texans, although, honestly, I was never a very big fan. Now, of course, Texas music is all over the map with a ton of great music coming from Denton alone which is where I went to college. With artists as varied as Brave Combo, Norah Jones and Midlake that city alone has enough talent coming out of it to satisfy most music lovers.

O’Shea: With your television graphics background–have you ever done videos for favorite independent bands of yours?

Miller: Unfortunately, no. When I graduated college, I quickly found myself drifting towards television advertising. I enjoyed the fact that you didn’t work on any one job for a very long time, the challenges were many and varied, and the pay was good. I discovered early on that, except for the videos you see on MTV, most music videos are incredibly low budget and are created by people who are passionate about the band. Now that I’ve reached a point in my career that I have access to a lot of cool toys and am not as concerned about where my next paycheck is coming from, I’ve extended the offer to edit videos to a few bands. None have taken me up on it yet, though. I did create an animation for Cloud Cult for them to use on their backdrop for their live shows. It was a lot more work than I had imagined it would be, but I’m very happy with the result. I also created a short animation featuring Chank fonts and the music of Pela. That video was featured on YouTube and has received just shy of half a million views.

O’Shea: Growing up and even now–are there certain radio stations that influence your musical tastes?

Miller: I grew up in East Texas where the radio station selection was pretty limited. I listened to what was on the radio, but I can’t say it had a big influence on me. I do remember huddling by my boom box listening to American Top 40 to hear what the new songs were every week. Even then I knew there was more music than what I was hearing on the radio, but didn’t really have a way to get to it. As I got into high school, my friends and I shared our music and that became a bigger part of my listening habits than the radio. These days I rarely listen to the radio. The Dallas market, as I feel most markets are in the US, is rather lacking. However, the internet makes it possible to sample stations from other cities. These days I’m listening to KEXP and really enjoying it. And, of course, I listen to several podcasts very regularly.

O’Shea: Do you ever get leads on new music from listeners? Would you say your listeners fit a certain demographic or do you folks who listen from all over the world and from all different ages? In general, what kind of feedback have you gotten from listeners?

Miller: I do. I really enjoy it when listeners make suggestions. It let’s them get in on the whole idea of sharing great music you’ve found with other people. As far as who listens to Shifted Sound, I have a link on the Shifted Sound home page to a survey and have encouraged listeners to give me a bit of information about themselves. From what I’ve been able to find out, most of my listeners are men between the ages of twenty-five and forty-four who have kids and live in the U.S. So, they’re a lot like me. I think the tough thing about music podcasts is, as the host, I have to find people who have essentially the same taste in music as me. The fact that I’ve found as many listeners as I have amazes me on a pretty regular basis. And the feedback I’ve gotten has been very positive. The negative comment I get most is that the show is too short.

O’Shea: In the ever-increasing world of podcasts, what do you think makes Shifted Sound stand out from other podcasts? Are there other podcasters that have inspired you to try different things with the show? Can you list some of your favorite podcasts?

Miller: I believe there are two pretty big differences between Shifted Sound and most other music podcasts. First, I think a very big thing that sets Shifted Sound apart is the fact that I get permission from every band or artist I play before I play them. Most podcasters and bloggers are of the “if I play/post something you (as an artist) don’t want me to, let me know and I’ll stop.” I prefer to let the bands stay in control of their music. They know I’m playing it. Consequently, there are many artists I have not played because they wouldn’t let me. I think that also creates a tighter bond between the listeners and the artists I play. The bands want their music to be heard by the people who listen to Shifted Sound, and the listeners know what they are hearing is being played with permission by bands who embrace podcasting.

Secondly, Shifted Sound is not for music snobs. And I think anyone who has tried to explore the internet and podcasts for new music knows what I mean. These are the people who believe Sufjan and Wolfmother hung the moon and wouldn’t be caught dead listening to anything by Daughtry. Now, there’s nothing at all wrong with loving Sufjan Stevens or Wolfmother, it’s the attitude that some people have that music has to be under appreciated in order to be good. If it’s on the radio, it can’t be good. If it’s embraced by the masses, then it’s horrible. I think people have a wide variety of music they can like. And I also believe many, many independent artists would fit in perfectly on many radio stations. Independent music doesn’t mean “inaccessible.” Part of what I try to do on Shifted Sound is show people who might not be into independent music that there are many independent artists who would fit their tastes. It’s just a matter of bringing the listener and the right music together.

The primary influence behind Shifted Sound was and is Brian Ibbott from Coverville. He has become a pretty good electronic friend who has helped and encouraged me in many ways. It was from listening to Coverville that I gained enough confidence that I could create my own podcast. I can’t say he’s inspired me to do different things with the show, but the fact that he inspired me to do the show at all is the most important thing anyone has done to help me out.

Aside from Coverville, the other podcasts I enjoy pretty consistently are SModcast, filmmaker Kevin Smith’s show, Five Hundy by Midnight, which is a weekly show about Las Vegas and The Official Lost Podcast, which is, of course, about the tv show Lost. That’s really all I have time to keep up with. A lot of my commute is devoted to listening to music, either for the show or simply for enjoyment.

O’Shea: So far for 2008, have there been any particular labels or bands that you think have really hit a groove in 2008 and sparked your (and your listeners) interests?

Miller: Wow, there have already been so many! Now, I’ve said on the show that music isn’t simply new when it is first released, it’s new whenever you discover it. So, keeping that in mind, not all of these picks are releases from 2008, but they have all been played on Shifted Sound since January.

There’s a band from right here in Dallas called Hendrick who I think has an amazing amount of talent. Definitely one of those bands I could see making the leap to the big time. An album that came out overseas last year but just got a stateside release this year is The LK Vs. the Snow by the LK. Amazingly good Swedish pop which several listeners have loved. I think Brave Citizens could easily explode. They’ve got a huge sound for a duo, and they’ve got a great way with a hook. The first time I heard Chicago’s LeConcorde I was blown away. They have a sound that recalls the best 80′s alternative pop while sounding very current. Great Northern is another band who have received listener praise for their darker, more atmospheric sound. Sleepy Eepee is a great release from them. The Red Romance have a very cool self-titled pop album out that you should keep your ears open for. But I think the best highlight for me so far this year was celebrating the second anniversary of Shifted Sound with the one hundredth episode. For that show, I had several bands I’d played before send me new songs that had not yet been heard by the general public. I had several great songs on that show, but the closer, “Stars” by Wolfy was just amazing. I’m really looking forward to their new album this year. That band is poised to take over the airwaves.

O’Shea: Some podcasters seem to like to talk about the music almost as much as they play the actual music. You seem to like to let the music speak for itself in some episodes–is it hard to hold back and not speak more on some episodes?

Miller: Honestly, it’s not very difficult for me to keep my mouth shut. In fact, some times it’s hard for me to say enough. One of the things I wanted to do from the very beginning of Shifted Sound was let the music be the focus. It’s not called The Shelby Miller show. It’s not about me. I want listeners to form their own opinions about the music I’m playing. I try to give a few tidbits of information about the bands and artists I play, then play the music. I try not to make comparisons because if I make a comparison like “Wolfy sounds like a cross between the best parts of Coldplay and Keane” and you don’t like either of those bands, then you’ve already made up your mind about the song I am about to play. I don’t want that to happen. I don’t expect listeners to enjoy every single song I play, but I want them to trust me enough that they know I’ll be playing some good music which they will probably enjoy on some level. If that’s the reason they continue to listen to Shifted Sound, then I’ve been successful with the show.

Tim O’Shea: How did you first come up with the idea of Spare the Rock, and was it hard to get Ella to speak on air?

Bill Childs: We had moved to Northampton in the summer of 2004 for me to take a job teaching law school. At a local cafe, I came across a flyer for Valley Free Radio seeking programmers and people to help get the station started up. I had done radio in college (WMCN, 10 blazing watts of power) and was looking for a community-related activity, so I decided to apply for a show. I rapidly got involved on the policy side as well; I have dropped out of that role for the most part for quite a while, as there was some unpleasant infighting that seemed unproductive to me.

As a family, we’d been finding good kids’ music for a while, starting, as I suspect many did, with a NYT Magazine article about Dan Zanes. When we went to Amazon for that, it did the “you might also like…” thing for Justin Roberts, so we got that too. (Didn’t hurt that I’d seen Justin play in his grownup band Pimentos for Gus back in the early ’90s in Minneapolis.) That started us buying a fair amount of stuff. And in the DC area (where we moved from), we’d seen at least Dan Zanes and Justin Roberts at Iota Club & Cafe in Arlington. (Justin even sang happy birthday to Ella on her fourth birthday.)

As for Ella: Ella recently reminded me that she said exactly two things in our first show, and it took quite a while for her to really get into it. From the start, I wasn’t sure if it was going to be a show with both of us (now all three of us) or a show that I did while they hung out. It frankly still varies some; some weeks she wants to read and Liam wants to play, and that’s cool too. Mostly it’s a time to hang out. She’s a pretty outgoing kid — as she said yesterday, perhaps evidencing some parental failings, “I like to talk to strangers!” — so it didn’t take a lot for her to decide it was fun.

O’Shea: Do you see ways that their co-hosting experience has indirectly helped Ella and Liam in school?

Childs: That’s an interesting question. They’ve got no fear of talking in front of their classmates, though I don’t think either of them would anyway. I asked Ella, and she says it’s helped her not be shy and that she was more shy in kindergarten than she was in first grade. I never perceived her as shy, but if it’s changed her self-perception, that’s to the good.

Liam is taking longer to get involved in the show in a big way, and he may never decide it’s really for him, which is cool too. We’ll see.

O’Shea: What’s the biggest challenge in doing a weekly show? Has your wife ever been concerned the show demands too much of your time?

Childs: Second question first: Not really; we both think of it as kid-time more than me-time. And even if you add up everything that I’m doing with that and my day job, it’s still less time than I was spending in (law) practice, so that’s good. Some of the peripheral stuff — writing columns, putting together shows — sometimes gets a little overwhelming, but we’re budgeting time better now.

As for the first question: The biggest challenge in doing a weekly show is that you have to do it even if you’re cranky or tired or sick. Pre-recording (as we are now doing) makes it easier to choose times to do it to avoid those times, but it’s still demanding.

O’Shea: When you first started the show, did you ever envision becoming in essence a concert promoter to some degree as well?

Childs: Not at all. But as we moved along and started to get to know some of the artists, I realized there was a gap that we could help fill, and, working with folks like Sienna (from HilltownFamilies.org) and local venues, we’ve had a lot of fun shows. (And we’ve got more coming up, if you’ll permit the plug – watch the calendar at our website.)

O’Shea: You frequently have guest DJs. Once Ella and Liam get older could you see turning the show over to other folks?

Childs: Possibly. On the new station, it’s not as much purely up to me, but we’ll see. Both kids seem to be interested in sticking around with it for a while yet, so I have not had to worry a ton about it. I could also envision continuing even without kids in the relevant age range.

O’Shea: What changes have been made to the show since it started also airing on The River? How did this new arrangement come about?

Childs:The only major changes have been pre-recording and having a little more structure in terms of sets — we have to deliver six segments of a set range of times. The latter has made it so we’re now planning the show in advance. That removes a little bit of spontaneity, but I also think it sometimes ends up with better and more interesting sets.

The other thing it’s added is access to WRSI’s huge music library and recording equipment. The in-studio performances, I think you’ll find, sound better than ever, the equipment just doesn’t crash, and we suddenly have access to thousands of songs we never had before. All of the music we played on the show while at VFR either came in as submissions from kids’ artists or were from our personal library. We have a good library, but nothing like a real AAA radio station that’s been around for 25 years. I’m just starting to really explore it.

Most other changes are fairly minor. I’ve gone along on one sales call for someone who’s considering sponsoring our show; that was more fun than I expected. I’ve probably tweaked our playlists a little to fit the station’s roots emphasis, but that wasn’t at the station’s request and may just be from listening to the station more.

Basically, I contacted the station (WSRI 93.9 The River) about potentially sponsoring a pretty big kids’ concert (still hoping that comes together; we’ll see), not at all about doing the show there. They were enthused about the concert possibility and also asked if we wanted to discuss doing the show there. They’d been thinking about adding a kids’ show for a while and we happened along at the right time.

O’Shea: In terms of WRSI’s huge music library, can you mention any musical holy grails you have found so far?

Childs: It’s not so much holy grails as basic catalog stuff and some new things. An example of each — for the former, Rolling Stones. I’m a bit embarrassed to admit that our Stones collection is all on vinyl; the station has a bunch digitally, so we could finally play She’s a Rainbow. For the latter, I heard Richard Julian‘s great Springtime is Coming on the station a few weeks ago and realized it would fit perfectly — Lyle Lovettish in sound, good theme — so we played it. I’ve got an ever-growing list of tracks I hear on the station during the week to think about playing on the show.

O’Shea: What is it about TMBG’s music (each show begins and ends with a TMBG song) that you think allows it to equally appeal to adults and children?

Childs: It’s smart, funny, accessible, and sometimes weird. That sense of goofiness and deadpan humor resonates at least with my kids, and I expect others.

Little-known fact: Ella originally wanted to start and end the show not just with TMBG songs, but with Dr. Worm every single show, start and end. Took a while to convince her that it was better to vary it some.

O’Shea: While the show is predominantly children’s music, you frequently play mainstream music in the show. How do you go about verifying there are no inappropriate lyrics in the song?

Childs: Mostly online searches, but I try to listen in advance too to any to make sure we don’t get burned. Early on I made a couple of (minor) mistakes with an Asylum Street Spankers song and a Gear Daddies song, so I’ve been more careful since then.

O’Shea: Do you have a favorite show (be it musically or be it in terms of the positive impact on you and your family) or a favorite set list from your time so far?

Childs: Well, we’re well over 100 shows now, so it’s hard to narrow it down. I would say there are three categories of shows that I like a lot:

- one type would be a fairly straightforward show where things just go well — Ella’s running the board and doing great at it and feeling good about it, Liam’s engaged, the music is good, and we all have fun. Nothing specific, just a good show.

- the second would be when we have really fun guests who aren’t thrown by things like a history quiz and who seem to be genuinely into it. Every time we have the Deedle Deedle Dees, or Keith Munslow, or a bunch of other guests, that’s the case. Those are the shows that really feel like we’re adding something to the community and the music scene.

- the third type of show I love is when we’re the first people anywhere to play a particular artist. I think we were first to air Frances England, for example, and there are a lot of examples of that. Getting to find terrific independent artists is great fun for me. I actually owned a record store in Minneapolis for a year back in the early ’90s, and similarly, I liked getting people to buy independent or minor label releases (we sold a ton of Green Day when they were still on Lookout! Records, for instance, and they actually did an acoustic in-store for us).

O’Shea: How on earth did you end up owning a record store and other than Green Day, were there any other in-store appearances that you had (really it’s hard to top Green Day, don’t get me wrong).

Childs: A friend of mine and I thought the west bank of Minneapolis needed one. We had some money saved up and opened one, about 300 square feet inside another store. It went well – we were more or less breaking even – but she decided she wanted to do something different and I decided to return to college, so we sold it to folks who didn’t do as well and closed rapidly.

We only had one other in-store by a band called No Apparent Reason from River Falls, Wisconsin. I still like them — kind of melodic punk with almost a prog-rock tinge to it — but no idea what happened to them.

O’Shea: A great many of musical acts you play are folks that also have once been or continue to do “adult” acts for lack of a better term. For the adults, could you offer some musical acts (formerly or still ongoing) that you wish people would check out in addition to enjoying their family music efforts?

Childs: I really like Justin Roberts’s non-kids’ stuff, both with Pimentos for Gus and solo; his drummer and producer, Liam Davis, has a good project called Frisbie as well. ScribbleJim’s grown-up band the ShysterS (capitalization intended) is really pretty great poppy punk. Liz Mitchell’s other work with Ida is beautiful.

O’Shea: When you have in-studio guests, they always seem to flourish–even the time (can’t remember the band) when one of the members had an upset child to (understandably) tend to in mid-show. Would you agree it’s pretty hard to rattle musicians who play for children, given that at any moment a toddler can unintentionally become a pseudo-heckler.

Childs: That was the Deedle Deedle Dees. Poor little Hazel had problems (again understandable) during the show they played later that day, and Lloyd ended up with her in a front carrier while he was singing and playing bass.

In any event, yes, I think family musicians are probably more inured to interruption and the like than the average twenty-something rocker. Perhaps that’s why they’re also not thrown so much by Ella’s history quiz.

O’Shea: Here’s what really blows me away (about you). The same guy that digs up an old John Cale/Brian Eno tune is also the law professor who once specialized in amusement ride safety. Out of curiosity, when the state fair or something of that ilk comes to town, can you ride the rides–or do you know too much about risks to be able to enjoy the rides?

Childs: I actually still specialize in amusement ride safety. And yes, I absolutely ride the rides; while the cases are interesting for a variety of reasons, the absolute risks are very small and largely avoidable. If it looks genuinely sketchy, don’t ride it; if the ride operator seems drunk or confused or inattentive, don’t ride it; and so on. A great resource for parents about that subject is Kathy Fackler’s www.saferparks.org.

(An aside, showing how the worlds occasionally intermingle: Through an exchange of e-mails, I recently figured out that Sippy Paul of the Sippy Cups was once roommates with a guy, Shaun Sutner, who has interviewed me for the Worcester paper‘s excellent coverage of a ride fatality in that area of the state.)

O’Shea: After I first contacted you about an interview, it came up that both of us share an appreciation of Tony Kornheiser‘s radio work. I was wondering if there are folks that you respect in radio, or in other words, you consider to be your radio heroes.

Childs: I think he (Kornheiser) does talk radio about as well as anyone I can think of. My music radio heroes are mostly from Minnesota — Mary Lucia (on MPR’s The Current [thecurrent.org], formerly of a bunch of stations going back to Rev-105) programs and hosts as well as anyone, ever; I also really like Barb Abney (now on The Current, formerly at WOXY.com). Farther back, Kevin Cole, now at KEXP in Seattle but previously at KJJO and Rev-105 in the Cities, is brilliant. And, not to be too obnoxious, I think the folks at WRSI are doing really creative work making what is obviously a commercial station also be a genuine community station.

O’Shea: What is it about your radio heroes that you admire and try to emulate?

Childs: That they are people rather than just personalities. You know who Tony is, you know who Lucia is, you know who Barb is, etc., etc. A big part of why those folks (and others I mentioned) are successful in that regard is that they more or less program their own shows — the Current’s DJs pick the songs they play, Tony talks about what he wants to talk about, etc. And they’re really good at choosing songs/ subjects in terms of pacing, structure, etc. That’s what I’ve always wanted our show to feel like — us listening to some fun music and having our sometimes-weird conversations between.

O’Shea: One more follow-up–in what ways is WRSI becoming a genuine community station?

Childs: Their promotional events have been a lot more about local community things rather than, for example, giving away trips. So this week, for instance, the morning guy (and PD) Monte is camping on the courthouse lawn until they raise $10,000 for a local cancer support organization. While there’s promotional value to the station to that too, they could have chosen something much more traditional that probably would be less work for them, but they went with the thing that actually adds value to the community. It’s part of this series of events they call “The Riverlution.”

Tim O’Shea: As you quickly approach your 400th episode (as of today [January 7, 2008] he’s up to podcast 408), from your perspective, in what ways has the show drastically changed and have any parts remained (other than the show’s core premise) essentially the same?

Brian Ibbott: I think the overall feel of the show has stayed consistent, but I’ve become so much more comfortable with the microphone. It’s only taken me 400 shows to get there!

O’Shea: In listening to this 2005 Podcast Solutions interview you mentioned at that time, you had around 3,500 CDs. Has the collection grown that much (in the old buy a CD traditional sense) or do you mostly download music now?

Ibbott: It’s grown in both ways. I still buy a lot of CDs, and have a lot mailed to me from bands and labels. But when I can, I like the buy-by-thesong services, like iTunes and eMusic, and Amazon’s excellent new mp3 store. As on May 9, 2005, when I did that interview, I had about 2,000 cover songs in my library. As of right now, I have 10,710.

O’Shea: I’ve only been listening to podcasts for a little over a year, but in that time (where I’ve listened to relatively mainstream media sources, such as Disney/ESPN, VH1/Viacom and NPR, as well as independent folks like yourself) you are the only podcast who has created an infrastructure that makes it convenient to go back and forth to exact points in the show. What does it require on the front end for you (special software, time spent formatting) to make this possible?

Ibbott: It actually adds about an hour to the show creation time, although I can see that amount of time getting shorter as I get better. I record the show live to WireTap Pro, and then I open the AIFF file in GarageBand. I can then go through the show and add markers to the beginning and end of each song, and each intro.

O’Shea: There are moments when I’m listening to the show and my jaw just drops with shock and awe (the non-military kind of shock and awe). Most recent case in point, I’m listening to Coverville 393, and you have Death Cab for Cutie‘s cover of Julian Cope‘s World Shut Your Mouth.
A) I had no idea that Death Cab for Cutie had covered the tune
B) Until now I had no idea that anyone other than me had ever liked that Julian Cope tune.
How often does a request come in that appeals to you on a personal level and, to a certain extent, you feel validation that “OK someone else liked that song as much as I do”.?

Ibbott: All the time – I’m a big music geek, so there is a lot of potential for me to hear a song that I hadn’t heard in a long time in cover form! But for every handful of those, there are quite a few where I’d never heard the original OR the cover before!

O’Shea: You do a lot of extra steps to give your listeners greater involvement in the show. For example, while you’ll take requests via email, it seems pretty clear that you much more prefer when folks call in requests, so that you can play them actually making the request. What motivates you to go that extra, seemingly more time-consuming route?

Ibbott: It actually takes the same amount of time for each, and I could do it a lot better if I were better organized! For example, I keep all the requests in a single playlist, along with the call-in audio files, so it’s very easy for them to get lost if they’ve been in there for a while.

O’Shea: Do you come up with the catchy names for the specific shows (for example “Coverville 390: Will I be pretty? Will I be rich? Will I play cover requests?”) or do you brainstorm with your wife, Tina, sometimes?

Ibbott: I come up with those – and it’s kind of funny how I do it. As I’m recording the show, I’m writing the shownotes, making the Amazon links, etc. As soon as I finish that part, I try to come up with a name for the show (if it isn’t a Cover Story, Interview or theme which would have a consistent title). Whatever song is playing when I finish, I try to find a good lyric in the song to “transform” to include “cover” and/or “request”.

O’Shea: Speaking of Tina, how do you strike a balance between show demands (you produce and host two other shows) and staying happily married?

Ibbott: It was a lot harder to balance this before I started doing the shows during the day! She’s off working, and I’m podcasting, and then we’re both usually done by the time the 5:00 bell rings.

O’Shea: Final Tina-related question on this round–when did she first start appearing on the show?

Ibbott: Another example of where I could be better organized! I think it was 106 – that was the first Musically Challenged trivia segment.

O’Shea: You fully admit on some podcast request shows that you play some stuff that, were it left up to you, would never make the podcast. What was the worst (or least entertaining) song you ever had to play on a request episode? In that same vein, what request came in that, upon initial suggestion, you were not looking forward to hearing, but once you heard the cover, the version quickly won you over?

Ibbott: There’s a grey area there. There are actually covers that are requested that I won’t even play. If it sounds too much like the pap you hear on “current hit” radio, I won’t play it. A recent cover of Boston‘s Amanda comes to mind, but that was played more as a joke than as a true request. But songs that I didn’t like on initial listen grow on me all the time. Flunk‘s True Faith is a recent one that went from “meh” to “wow” in just a couple listens.

O’Shea: Going back to close to the beginning of Covervillle, you once did an October 2004 show “from a relatively empty gate during a four-hour layover in Chicago’s O’Hare airport”. Is that the most unique place you have ever recorded the show, or can you think of one better?

Ibbott: I think it would be. I’ve done shows in hotel rooms, and pieced together bots from live on the floor of the Podcast Expo, but I think O’Hare would be the most unusual. I’m not sure I could do it now, with all my equipment and screen real estate needs!

O’Shea: Of the variety of Coverville themes you’ve done (which according to your Wikipedia entry include Cover Story; Originalville; A Cappella; Lost In Translation; Cover To Cover Interview; Coverville Idol; Degrees of Coveration) which demands the most amount of your time to produce?

Ibbott: The Degrees of Coveration are very tough, but when you find a great song to link, it makes it a lot easier. The best situation is when you find an artist whose been around a long time covering something relatively new. It makes things a lot easier.

The interview shows take quite a while to do, and a lot of it is arranging a time to record with the interviewee, and coming up with good questions. And editing. Lots of editing. I have to listen through the interview three or four times to put everything into a logical order.

O’Shea: Have many stations/companies from traditional/terrestrial radio or satellite venues inquired about syndicating or otherwise broadcasting Coverville?

Ibbott: Not as many as I wish! If I could find someone in the know to help me, I’d love to pitch the show to XM or Sirius. I think my selections are a little too eclectic and varied for a fixed-format radio station. KYOU in San Francisco runs my show every weekday at 3pm. That’s a nice foot in the door, and hopefully I can turn it into more!

O’Shea: Are there any particular artists or bands that you can point to and give Coverville partial credit for their post-Coverville appearance success?

Ibbott: Copper Box, who makes it into the Countdown every year sent me an email after I first played them, telling me that they’ve gotten a lot of emails from people who heard them on the podcast. But I don’t think anyone could point to my show as any kind of credit for their success. It’s their talent and creativity that make them, and I’d never dream of being conceited enough to try and claim some of that credit!

O’Shea: On to some of your other podcasts, how did your Denver Post-related Lyrics Undercover and Podcast Network‘s Today in Music History come about?

Ibbott: A friend turned me on to an ad that they were looking for a podcaster to handle their morning news podcast (where you’d have to get up at the crack of dawn – or earlier – and read the headlines into an mp3 and post it). It turned out that the guy I spoke to was a huge fan of my show, and knew who I was. He asked me to come up with a couple of music-related shows, and I pitched TIMH and Lyrics Undercover. They liked both, “hired” me, and basically allowed me to quit my day job. They had budget cuts recently, and had to drop TIMH, which TPN picked up, but they still have Lyrics Undercover.

O’Shea: Your workload seems pretty full at present (with your Wii and Not So Lame podcast) but is there any chance you may tackle other podcast shows in 2008?

Ibbott: No plans – but you never know what might come up. I’d love to do something huge for my 500th show, like a concert out in Vegas around the time of the 2008 Expo, but I don’t know if I’ve got the time to organize something like that!